laying a liner over a liner

[Cinnamon]

Is it possible for us to put a liner over the top of this one that is leaking so bad? I am still trying to find someone close to us that does the spray on. Now if we can afford it. If we can't I don't know what we will do. I guess get out of the koi :crybaby:

[Terri]

Hi Cin :)

There is no reason not to use the old liner as an underlay for the new liner. You may want to tape down the folds, etc, on the old liner before putting the new liner in.

[Koidaddy]

I left my old liner in when increasing the size!:yup:

[Jackie Ramo]

Certainly leave the old liner in, the land fill doesn't need it and it will benefit the new pond acting as a protective barrier

[clm]

I would leave it in as well. It certainly would make good underlay for the new one.

Cindy

[Cinnamon]

The only problem we have is trying to put the new liner under the waterfalls. Impossible to do. I don't know how we would seal it at the waterfalls. We could lap over the top and hold it with rocks. I am still wating to hear from the spray on liner guy. Here are some pics of my pond mess now.

[philly]

Might be possible to cut the liner at the first step where it flows over slip the new liner under and use double sided tape to seal it there.

[Jackie Ramo]

Cinn get us a pick of the holey part please

[philly]

I think Cinn said where it's leaking were like pin holes in the liner that might be hard to see.

[Cinnamon]

Philly some of the holes are bigger. I will try tomorrow to take some pics of the bottom so I can post them.

[philly]

If you have to install a new liner it's the right time to do all your upgrades and tweaking in your system now Cinn. :)

[Marg]

The only problem we have is trying to put the new liner under the waterfalls. Impossible to do. I don't know how we would seal it at the waterfalls. We could lap over the top and hold it with rocks. I am still wating to hear from the spray on liner guy. Here are some pics of my pond mess now.

Hi Cin,
When we installed our pond and water falls, we laid down the pond with enough to come up over the waterfall edge as if the waterfall wasn't there.
The installation of the falls was seperate. The bottom edge of the falls was laid over like an overskirt and extended about a foot into the pond.
This way if anything shifted it was still covered.

Are going to use the liner in the waterfall as "the liner" or as an underlay and still add new there? If you want to still use it as "the liner" and just replace the pond part, I would cut the liner from the falls so it is a long skirt into the pond that would overlap your new liner that covers the pond and sides right up under the "skirt" . I am sure you would make sure the new liner is well above water level all around including where the waterfalls enters the pond.

Hope this helps,
Marg

[philly]

Marg, that's a pretty good idea for Cinn saves her a lot of work. :yup:

[Marg]

Sometimes DH wonders what was I thinking....:HAHA:
Marg

[philly]

He would probably go crazy trying to figure out what you were thinking. :HAHA:

[Cinnamon]

We still haven't decided what we are going to do. It all depends on the estimate from the spray on liner. Here are some pics of the holes that we took yesterday. There are hundreds of holes like this in the bottom. Remmy said he didn't want to have to do this again in 3.5 yrs.

Marg that is the way I was thinking to do the waterfall.

[philly]

Those hole looks odd, I wonder if the liner was defective right from the manufacturer, they could have made a bad batch you know. :yup:

[Jackie Ramo]

I agree Phil. They look like little cracks that opened up or someone with a lot of time took a fork to it.

[Peg]

Hi Cin, I would cut out a section and take it back to where you got it. Most liners have a 20-25 year warrenty, have them replace it. If they don't raise hell how ever you can. From the pics it looks like you would have had more come threw in a short time later even if you patched it. If you check the net there are places you can order the spray on liner and DIY.

[Jackie Ramo]

Unfortunately the dealer is long gone Peg so she would have to deal with the Manufacturer who is probably firestone. I'd send them a pic any way costs nothing and they may cough up a coupon for half off or something.

[philly]

Yes I agree with Peg, take a sample back to them and make some noise a lot of noise, remember the squeaky wheel always get greased, :yesyes: you might end up with a whole new liner and all you have to do is install it. :yup:

[Cinnamon]

Peg the guy I bought the liner from is now in a Federal Pen for 10 yrs. Kind of hard to find out where he got it. You know the leaking started after 1.5 to 2yrs. It gradually got worse until the final straw when I was putting 1000 gallons of water in every 12 hrs!! That is when I bought the swimming pool and put them in it.

Remmy said the liner just cracks when you touch it now.

I haven't found any DIY spray liner on the net yet. If you find one let me know.

[philly]

If you flip the liner over can you see who made it ? if you can go directly to that manufacture and they will warranty it for you. :yup:

[Marg]

Was it a nude liner or lined with rocks? Just wondering as some of us have rocks big and small.
Good luck,
Marg

[Terri]

Not spray on ..would work tho...
http://www.hechtrubber.com/Pages/FishPondCoatings.htm

Cin,was the original liner PVC or EPDM?

[Cinnamon]

Terri the origal liner is EPDM.

I had some extra pieces of the liner and the manufacturer is not on those pieces at all. The liner is shot anyway I guess I could cut part of it and see. Although if we get a big rain all the red clay mud will come through it yuck! Don't think I want to do that.

Marg We only had a couple of small river rocks holding down a couple of folds. No big rocks and no tiny rocks at all.

[Cinnamon]

I messed around with 2 different guys from Austin for the last 2 weeks. They seemed interested and said it was not too far to come to do the liner. I sent pics and dimensions and can't get them to call me back. Ain't that something??? They must not need the work. Remmy called the main Gator Guard guy in Ft. Worth yesterday. He trained one of the guys in Austin. I sent pics early evening and by 9 pm he had me a bid! YEA!!!

Remmy said this is the way we are going to do it. He doesn't want to mess with another EPDM and the headache it would be trying to fit it in the pond. So it looks like we will have a Dark Blue spray on liner sometime in August. The guy is calling me at 10:30 am this morning to discuss it further.

It is expensive but we will never have to worry about it ever again!!:yeahbaby:

[philly]

Good luck then, hope's it's all works out for you. :)

[Cinnamon]

Thanks Philly! I do have a correction. They will be here Sunday or Monday! I get the new liner next week!!! :clap: I just got off the phone with the guy :)

[philly]

Make sure you get his drivers licence so in the future you can track him down if you have any problems also take his vehicle serial number if it's fairly new in case you need to put a lien on it. :grin:

[Jackie Ramo]

Hey Cinn, so glad that you are getting things to work out for you. I know how much your pond and fish mean to you. Will be nice not to have to worry about it anymore.

[carcha koi]

Can't wait for the update. How are the fish doing until their new home is built.

[Marg]

I do have one more question though....You posted pictures of the cuts in the bottom of the liner. Were the cuts also up the sides and in the falls?
I just wondered if any "animal"? would be making them from underneath...
Hope all goes as planned and that you get to enjoy your fish soon.:yup:
Marg

[Cinnamon]

Chris the fish aren't very happy right now. It is tooo hot to eat!!! I am sure they will be happy to get back in their pond! I know I will be glad to get them there. Now the trick is going to be getting the water temps close enough to move them. We are so hot and dry right now. The temp in the pool has been up to 92F. Way too hot.

Marg no animal could have done this damage from underneath. It is the liner that is rotting and tearing apart. While Remmy was in there it crunched under his feet :(

I will at least have some piece of mind after this. I will never have to worry about a leak again. The material has been tested out to 75 yrs! It is 120ml thick too. I picked the color of Midnight blue. The guy is spraying a gray for a first coat primer. He said the grey will turn a moss green. Then he is going to spray the blue. He said he will bring enough grey in case I don't like the blue and want to go back to grey !!! hahahaha He said he wants a happy customer. We are putting them up in our travel trailers while they are here for 3 days.

[carcha koi]

I'm sure they will be happier in their new home, As for the heat send some our way. It is cold and crappy.:crybaby:

[Cinnamon]

'k everyone, Remmy here,
It is official...... We have passed the point of no return.
The wheels of progress have been set in motion and the emergency brake thrown to the side. (as a lump forms in my throat). Final transactions finalized on the new liner application procedure.

Just came from the pool (our fish's temp home now for nearly two years) and watched the guys swimming about in search of food.... and realized that it definately is worth it.... at least to us and that is all that really counts here. Also to the fish; can't leave them out. It isn't the fish's fault we didn't start out as experts in this field but man have we ever learned. :banghead: We appreciate their patience with us. Their understanding too if that is plausible. The experiences we have have acquired in Koi ponding have been priceless but not without price. RIP Blondie (one our 1st).
I have been catching jokes at the office for the last week now about the 'ultimate fish fry' versus 'reparations'. In my line of work, we centralize towards cost effectivenes so where did I go wrong? Either they don't understand it one bit or I have missed the boat embarassedly so. I went back to an earlier post I made a couple of years ago "Is It Really Worth It" and it still holds as true today as it did then. I don't know what we would do without those guys and gals.

As I type, a crew from the Dallas/Ft Worth area will be making their way here in the next few days for an 'extreme pond make-over' of sorts. Am I nervous???
:crybaby: Terrified? :roll: Heck I could click on all of those 'little faces' and I don't think I would have hit the correct one. Have I mentioned apprehensive? Just kidding. Cinn and I have talked it over and over and it appears that things have just fallen in place. Maybe it is an omen... who knows. As she so frequently states, everything happens for a reason.

All I can say is that I wish to thank each and every one of you for your support and advise through the years with our venture into and through the lands of the unknown. Maybe I should have said 'waters of the unknown'?

Wish us luck as Cinn and I jump from the 'perfectly good airplane' in the sky into the unchartered water below.
Hey Cinn, did you remember to grab the parachutes????? :lol:


From somewhere deep in the heart of Southeast Texas,
Remmy and Cinn!

(Film at 11:00)
followed by regular updates every hour on the hour....maybe that is a bit much but we will keep you all informed. :wink:

[Cinnamon]

Chris you want this 99-101 F temps?? You can sure have it! Not to mention the HIGH humidity to go with it. Our heat indexes have been running as high as 115 last week. We did catch a small break today as we recieved a 5 min rain shower. Our first in over a month. We are hot hot and dry. I have had to put the water to all my plants and the lawn. Everyone else's lawn is fried. I refuse to let my beautiful lawn burn up!! Water is not that expensive here :)

[carcha koi]

Well we have had plenty of rain and cold weather. Temps in the 60's not really summer weather. We have had 3 hot days so far. I'll still take some of your weather as our winters are just too long to have a cold damp summers.

[philly]

Yeah Chris wished we had better weather but we will take what is thrown on us as long it's not snow. :yup:

[carcha koi]

That will be soon enough.:doh:

[Peg]

Good luck Remmy and Cinn! Wow, wish I was there to see this happen. Please keep us posted on the work as its being done and dont forget the pics to go along with it. I'm sure the koi will be quite happy with thier new home.

[Cinnamon]

I'll do my best to send this heat up your way! We are so happy. We actually got a good rain shower this evening. First one in over a month! I know it cooled the fish pool down some which is a good thing. On the other side it put water in the pond and they are coming Monday. Maybe it will all be evaporated by then. That is what doesn't leak out hahaha

[philly]

I guess you're both anxious to see the end results. :yup:

[Jackie Ramo]

You know the rules Cinn!! We want Pics! Nothing better than seeing other people work!!:lol:

[philly]

Is that seeing other people work that had other people help or do it. :grin:

[Jackie Ramo]

Doesn't matter as long as its not me working:frisbee:

[Rembrandt]

You want to see work? :lol:

Here we are in the earlier stages of the deck cover project.
I had just finished reinforcing the underside of the deck where each column will rest. It appears they are simply resting on the deckboards but that is an illusion. I have to admit that it was cooler under the deck than it was topside.

Those columns were salvaged from a 'face-lift' that took place at one of my old offices where 17 columns were replaced with newer fiberglass units. Most were in good condition. They had to be modified slightly for them to work on my project but we have all the tools we needed to do it. Pam has some really cool 'toys'. That table saw cabinet is one of the things that Pam came up with and built. Works great and has witnessed many projects.

The other two people in the pictures are my parents. Excellent assistants when tackling projects like this and just all around great people!

Definately a lot of work but it is coming along.
After looking at those pictures again, I dooooo believe it is Miller-Time!:yup:

Remmy

[philly]

Just looking at all the work you all are doing makes me tired already. :HAHA:

[Jackie Ramo]

I love it when people reuse things in creative ways. This is going to look great

[Rembrandt]

Yeah Jackie, I'm starting to get excited here. I think it will really look good too. Talked to the man this morning and the crew will be out here Monday to start. Not to worry, we will take plenty of pics. I have a good friend that is coming out this weekend to help me remove the stones from the pond. You find out who your REAL friends are when you have a KOI pond. :lol:

Remmy

[philly]

Gee I guess I don't really have any friends at all because the only ones that helped me are my relatives and that's a good chance it's repayment for me helping them first. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

hmmmmmmmmmmm.... as Remmy just realized the pics with his parents helping.... Philly, you may just have a point there. :-|
Remmy

[philly]

Well Remmy, the most important thing is there is help when you really need it be it relatives or friends as long someone is there giving you a hand. :lol:

[Jackie Ramo]

I'd help you Phil, you've been a big help to me.:yup:

[Cinnamon]

Remmy's Mom and Dad can't help on this right now. They are on a month long vaction up in the North! They went to Wyoming and now they are in North Dakota seeing Mount Rushmore. They are having a blast!

And me.... I am no help at all. Especially in the heat. I can barely make it from the house to the shop! :doh:

[philly]

I'd help you Phil, you've been a big help to me.:yup:

Jackie, with that mischievous smile who wouldn't help you and besides you're great company to be around never a dull day. :lol:

[philly]

Remmy's Mom and Dad can't help on this right now. They are on a month long vaction up in the North! They went to Wyoming and now they are in North Dakota seeing Mount Rushmore. They are having a blast!

And me.... I am no help at all. Especially in the heat. I can barely make it from the house to the shop! :doh:

I'm glad Remmy's parents are enjoying their vacation, that's what we all hope to do one day when we're retired. :yesyes:

NEVER say you're no help after all you there to give moral support and probably tell a few jokes to help pass the time. I would rather have someone around that can't physically help out than work alone all by myself that get very boring. :smile:

[Jackie Ramo]

Some one has to keep the food and cold drinks coming for the workers.

[philly]

Yes I know you like to delegate and we have to do the work so if you bring the food and drinks you get more work done and less time wasted if we had to fetch our own. :HAHA:

[Cinnamon]

Good Morning everyone, (Remmy here from Cinn's 'puter),
Survived day one of the weekend. Got more progress on the deck cover as well as working on the pond project. Jeesh, didn't know we had that many rocks!! Had to move them as mentioned earlier. Pulled plants, etc. Hadn't seen it this way in years. Cinn worked her tail off at the bridge with the vaccuum canister. And then made strawberry margarittas with some special stuff we brought back from Cancun probably about 8 years or so? Ummmmmm, so GOOD ........and then I slept. :grin:

I'll get Cinn to upload some pictures.
Remmy

[Jackie Ramo]

How long did the guys say it would take to spray on the liner? Lots of work but soon lots of enjoyment with no worry.

[philly]

You all must be having a party over there. I hope you're getting some work done. :HAHA:

[Cinnamon]

I have always made one heck of a Supervisor! :lol: I am VERY good at that job :) I guess it comes from owning my own company for so long. I love to delegate too. I fill that position for sure. Hey I do bring Remmy drinks and cook for him! I plan on cooking for the crew while they are here. Monday night I am making grilled bratwurst with sauteed mushrooms and onions. YUM YUM!

Jackie the guy said it would take 2-3 days to do the job. They are arriving Monday afternoon. I don't know how much they can get done but will probably start fresh Tuesday morning.

You know they are getting free room and board. I don't think you can beat that! Especially home cooked meals. Tuesday night is Spaghetti. After that I don't know yet.

[philly]

Cinn, Jackie loves to delegate cooking that I don't know but from what you have just described it's mouth watering you got room for one more :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

Remmy here,

Time of the 'Workend' update....
Had a transformer blow in our neighborhood. Lost all power on our street and when the power returned, Cinn's puter would not come back up. :banghead: She is on her way into town to have it fixed. Asked me to let you all know where she was.

Got the pond cleared out and stuff moved. It has been a long time since I've seen it that way. The guys are on their way and should be here this afternoon. Just waiting patiently now.

As for the deck, the temperature picture tells a good story. :hot:
I now have the remaining rafters gathered and ready to trim. Could go faster but the heat drains you so fast. My fan is my buddy!

Here are some pics.....

[Rembrandt]

Just a few more pics....

Remmy

[philly]

Very nice Remmy, I especially like the view from inside window and neat workmanship when can you come up this way and start on mine. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

Thanks Philly for the compliment! I enjoy doing that kind of work it just gets me that my projects take so long to complete. Cinn and I are looking forward to getting our backyard oasis projects DONE!!

....which reminds me, Cinn called me just a moment ago from the puter place and her motherboard is ....:tantrum::sosad:

They are retrieving her data and building her a new one.
Should be back on line by the end of the week.
Remmy

[Jackie Ramo]

So did the guys arrive??? This is exciting. I am so happy for you both. A dead computer, not an expense you two need right now... poop

[philly]

You gotta tell Cinn to go easy on the electronics. :)

[Koidaddy]

Rem, Awesome job... sure love the columns... don't know how anyone can endure temps over 100 degrees... but still, I'm somewhat envious, as I do love the tropical plantings and the thought of all year enjoyment!

Again, great job!
KD
:grin:

[Rembrandt]

Hey Everyone!

Just a quick update....
Cinn's puter is definately down and they are building her another one and will be able to piggyback her data into the new one so not ALL was lost. She hopes to have it back in a couple of days. She is going nuts though without it and has been dying to bring you 'play by play' announcements of the masterpiece being created before our eyes. Simply stated.............., these guys are GOOD!!! :yup:
They arrived last night with a good sized trailer loaded with equipment. At 6:30 this morning it was a wide open project. Still blows my mind....

I will try and post some pics of the progress tomorrow. Yeah, I know..... but it is the soonest I can do it. I wish you could see this. Oh how we wish we would have done this from the very beginning.

Remmy and the temporarily fit to be tied, Cinn:banghead:
I gotta get back to work here......

[Jackie Ramo]

Well if we have to wait we have to wait but don't expect us to like it!!!

[Rembrandt]

Jackie, I understand. It is killing me to be here at the office all day while this is going on. My body is here but my mind and heart sure aren't.:)
Cinn just called and gave me a grocery list for the trip home as she is fixing the crew dinner tonight. (again)
You can't say WE don't take care of our people! :grin:

Remmy

[philly]

Well you might as well go home if you're not going to get any work done. :grin:

[Rembrandt]

Philly,
That's all I needed to hear!
Sounds good enough to me.
Catch you all tomorrow.... and will have pics too.:2cool:

Remmy

[philly]

At least you will get a few things done at home. :grin:

[Jackie Ramo]

So its like time already!!! Remm!!!!:frisbee::frisbee:

[philly]

Remmy, Jackie is waiting she seems a little impatient so are we all, where are the pics. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

Drum roll.............................................. ...........

We are BACK!!!!!! :5::party1:

[Koidaddy]

I'm blue with envy!! - Awesome job!!

KD
:grin:

[Marg]

They will love it! How long till they can go in?
Great job!
Marg

[Rembrandt]

Thank you, thank you, and thanks again!
I still need to reconnect the pumps and bring the waterfalls and filters back online. We hope to have the critters back in there next weekend. Already making plans for the 'rodeo'.
Cinn took 'bout a million pics of the whole thing and she is exploding to give all the details so I will leave that to her when she gets her new puter back.
The blue fade job that they did is incredible.
Needless to say, we are very pleased. I can't wait to see how the KOI will look in the pond. Gonna put diapers on them suckers! LOL

[philly]

They did a great job, the waterfall looks like you walk down the steps and just dive in very inviting. :yeahbaby:

[Jackie Ramo]

Stunning guys. I spoke to Cinn on the phone and she is just dancing with happiness. I bet the fish look fantastic in there.

Tomorrow Cinn says her computer is back and she will start uploading the working pics.

[Koidaddy]

Question... Won't all that blue eventually be hidden by a film of algae? (sorry to sound like a killjoy).

KD
:grin:

[philly]

Some of it will but if you clean it often it might be OK. :)

[Jackie Ramo]

One wants the thin film of algae it is part of the bio of the pond. The blue will still show somewhat

[Rembrandt]

Yeah it will eventually get green and the magical string algae will return but we will take many pictures of the KOI while everything is still fresh and blue. I plan on bringing all the pumps back on line this weekend and then we will watch the water. Then comes the 'Rodeo' as we like to call it.

Remmy.
....wonder if Cinn picked up her puter yet??

[philly]

I met a fella a couple months ago that has 60 koi in his pond 5,000 gallons no filtration except his waterfall is 2 feet high and the width of his pond lots and lots of flow over the top and lots of plants too, the koi are healthy, happy and huge. :)

[Rembrandt]

Cinn just called me, she is so excited and is on her way home with her new 'puter! Be prepared for the pics.
:hack: !strut
Remmy

[Cinnamon]

I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!! New puter and all. I am about to go and upload the pics. I will come back and post the link to the pics. I just wanted to say I missed everyone! :clap::yesyes:

[carcha koi]

Can't wait for the pics. I hope to post some when I have finished and the Kids upload the pics I have taken.

[philly]

I AM BACK!!!!!!!!!! New puter and all. I am about to go and upload the pics. I will come back and post the link to the pics. I just wanted to say I missed everyone! :clap::yesyes:

Someone sounds very very EXCITED! :smile:

[philly]

Can't wait for the pics. I hope to post some when I have finished and the Kids upload the pics I have taken.

Chris, we will be waiting now hurry up! :frisbee:

[Rembrandt]

...rubbing his eyes in total disbelief! Hey, I know her!
Welcome back.
:)!welcome

[Cinnamon]

Okay the construction pics are up! Here is the link :) enjoy

Sorry it took so long I had to reinstall a bunch of my programs to work on this computer so I could work on the pics. Then I had to print something for Remmy and had to d/l the driver and then print and realized my black ink was out! So NOW you know what took me so long hahahaha

http://pamsfavoritepictures.shutterfly.com

[Jackie Ramo]

Looks great Cinn. The guys sure worked neat which is so important. I bet that first trickle of water was a thrill. Did you lose gallons as it doesn't look like they dug out before doing the bricks?

[Cinnamon]

No Jackie if anything we gained gallons with that wrinkeld liner out of the pond. It looks bigger than it was for sure.

Nothing was dug out. That is the cinder block wall that I built after the collapse of the pond back in 2004. Seems like so long ago hahaha.

They put a concrete slurry floor over the dirt. It is not very thick but it is very strong. They could stand on it in just a couple hours and it did not break. After that they started the build up of the gator guard. One layer of this material you can' tear at all. He said the walls are around 100ml thick and the floor is 200 ml thick. I should NEVER have any problems with it EVER!!!

This guy is the one who first started this type of liners. He travels all over the US and he even said he would come to Canada to do ponds (hint)!

I can't wait to move the fish and start taking pics! They will look so awesome with the color of the pond. They have grown even more while they have been in their pool.

[Jackie Ramo]

Oh Cinn, I forgot about the collaspe of the pond... I'm surpised you didn't just fill it in ages ago!! At least now you can enjoy.

[Cinnamon]

Jackie it is hard for us to forget the collapse!! As much as we have been through since Aug 2004 you would have thought we would have given up. Most people would have. I guess we are just too stubborn! :lol:

Now I don't have to worry about anything and can really enjoy it as you say :)

[Jackie Ramo]

Well don't mess with those Texans

[Rembrandt]

Another busy workend....I meant weekend!
All the pumps are back online and the waters are once more running. Ah what an incredible sound. Best part is that there are NO leaks! With the help of my neice and nephew, we got all the rocks back at the pond. A labor of love. They did get to go swimming in it of course and they had a blast. I am now at the point of replacing the nylon rope. It deterioated and had to go. We wrapped it in duct tape to keep the fibers from falling into the pond and it worked pretty good. Now I am on the hunt for rope.
Remmy

[Rembrandt]

Here are a few of the pictures of the water testing and waterfall quality control process, How else can ya beat the 100 plus temps?? Cinn took a bunch of pictures.
Remmy

[Jackie Ramo]

Works for me. I watched Cinn's videos of the nephew swimming. Looks like lots of fun. 100F man that's hot!

[philly]

Those are two different looking kinda kois in the koi pond. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

Hey Gang,
Well tomorrow is the big day at our place. Pumps have been running a week now and all systems are go. Filters have all been started and everything looks great. Oh yeah, I put more lights in the pond last night. I just stood out there hypnotized by the flashing patterns on the side of my shop; made it look like fire dancing. I'll have to catch a picture of it.

We will start our rodeo tomorrow morning and have a gang lined up for the transfers. The pond temps are within 1-2 degrees F of each other and with our assembly line, the fish shouldn't be too disturbed. They definately are going to a much nicer home.

Wish us well with the RODEO! :lol:
Remmy

[philly]

Remmy good luck tomorrow you shouldn't have any trouble it should be smooth sailing I'm sure you have everything well planned. :greatday:

[Rembrandt]

Is it tomorrow yet???
Bet you can't tell I'm just a wee bit anxious???
Looked at the clock here at the office and it has been 2:15 now seems like nearly 2 hours now. Time is draggggging today.:)
Cinn is going to video part of the RODEO.
We plan on having 2 people in the pool, 1-2 people for the transfer from the pool area to the pond area, and then 1 on the receiving end in the pond.

And then an ice cold Miller Lite. Yeah, I know it will be early for that but it'll be 5:00 somewhere!

[philly]

Well you have a little under 1 hour to go unless you get stuck in traffic :HAHA: just remember no drinking on the job you don't want to drop any of the fishes but then again you're in the pond what harm can you do.
:lol:

[Rembrandt]

:lol: Philly.

Looking forward to it. Is it 5:00 yet? I do know Cinn will be happy. This is going to make the pond maintenance so much easier on her. Our temp DIY filter for the pool worked but it was a headache. That was a chore Cinn and I will not miss.

Catch ya later,
Remmy
(...:5::drunk:sneaking out the back door)

[Jackie Ramo]

Have a good time tomorrow, be sure to photo each fish and examine it for any potential problems.

[philly]

Its a very good time to get how many inches each one is and the weight also, as Jackie said check them out properly for anything in the works. :yup:

[Rembrandt]

Up & running!
Remmy & Cinn

[philly]

Remmy, nice looking kois. I see you have quite a few butterflys in the group there. :yesyes:

[Cinnamon]

It was all we could do to move them from the pool to the pond. We didn't stop to take individual pics or weigh them either. They were flashing so hard in the sock net. Our main concern was just getting them moved.

[Jackie Ramo]

Now Cinn you missed a golden opportunity. Transferring them in a sock net can do real harm unless its the type that holds water. That's why the pro's put them in plastic bags, they can be inspected measured and handled easily.

[Cinnamon]

Jackie I guess I am far far from a pro then :lol: This sock net did not hold water. I didn't know they had one that does. Anyway what is done is done.

[Jackie Ramo]

A sock net is not the worst thing to use to move them. And they are all fine and safe so no worries.

[philly]

But I have one have to check and see if it's one of those that holds some water. :scratch:

[Jackie Ramo]

Mine does not

[philly]

It's possible it does as it has that cloth type mid section and the ends are meshed. :)

[Rembrandt]

Hey there,
As for that net/sock or whatever it is, it is very soft. There isn't anything in there they can snag themselves on. The opening is about 12"-14" diameter ring and the fabric portion is about 5' in length. I can't reach both ends at the same time. The fish swim in and then you close the end they are heading to while closing it behind them. If I am too slow, they zip right through and then I have to catch them again. After I catch them and the ends are where they can't jump out (left hand closing the end and right hand holding the handle on the ring above the water), I let the net just rest in the water while waiting on my assistant. I watched them through the open hoop and the fish just kinda sit there moving easily. When it is time to raise them, I slowly start raising the 'packaged assembly' and let the water run out through the fabric. It is like a soft knit fabric and it takes a few secs for the water to run out. Once it drains, I play 'Hulk Hogan' and lift it over the pool side wall to the receiver. Reminds me of a giant Tootsie Roll for lack of a beter description. They are only out of the water for maybe 30-45 seconds. When they are introduced to the pond, Cinn simply lowers the 'package' in the water and releases the opening and they swim on through. The heavy ones were the most difficult simply because of their weight and size. The smaller ones were a snap-----once we caught em! :lol:
...Sorry, got long winded. Time for me to go home.
Remmy

[carcha koi]

Pond looks great as do the koi

[philly]

Hey there,
As for that net/sock or whatever it is, it is very soft. There isn't anything in there they can snag themselves on. The opening is about 12"-14" diameter ring and the fabric portion is about 5' in length. I can't reach both ends at the same time. The fish swim in and then you close the end they are heading to while closing it behind them. If I am too slow, they zip right through and then I have to catch them again. After I catch them and the ends are where they can't jump out (left hand closing the end and right hand holding the handle on the ring above the water), I let the net just rest in the water while waiting on my assistant. I watched them through the open hoop and the fish just kinda sit there moving easily. When it is time to raise them, I slowly start raising the 'packaged assembly' and let the water run out through the fabric. It is like a soft knit fabric and it takes a few secs for the water to run out. Once it drains, I play 'Hulk Hogan' and lift it over the pool side wall to the receiver. Reminds me of a giant Tootsie Roll for lack of a beter description. They are only out of the water for maybe 30-45 seconds. When they are introduced to the pond, Cinn simply lowers the 'package' in the water and releases the opening and they swim on through. The heavy ones were the most difficult simply because of their weight and size. The smaller ones were a snap-----once we caught em! :lol:
...Sorry, got long winded. Time for me to go home.
Remmy

The last time I helped moved some koi it took us the better part of 6 hours of course we had to go from the pond at the back of the house to the garage in the front where the 15' kiddie pool was and lifting the container with water and the koi in it was HEAVY! Yeah Remmy catching the koi and netting them with the sock net was OK we just twirl the ends of the sock net and lifted them right out of the pond 5' upwards to the container. :banghead:

[Jackie Ramo]

Yea, I have the same sock net. Never used it for catching fish except from the container, never in the pond. With my pond you have to use the long handled pan net to catch them, transfer them to the sock and from sock to cooler for transporting to the greenhouse or whereever

A big butterfly can break off parts of tail and fins in a sock net... ask GG.

[philly]

Poor GG what have you done to her ? :frisbee:

[Jackie Ramo]

Nothing recently and she has forgiven me for past transgressions:phfft:

[philly]

She must have Alzheimer's to forgive you so easily. :lol:

[Cinnamon]

I know a couple of them flopped really hard in the net. One in particular and that is the one that was slightly wounded. They seem to be doing great though. They have an appetite. I am not feeding them very much 2x day right now until the chemistry levels out. I had to add some Amquel yesterday. I am keeping a close watch for ammonia.

[philly]

Yes Cinn you will have to wait a little bit for the filtration to catch up before feeding heavily, I'm glad the kois are all Ok, small water changes will help also. :yup:

[Jackie Ramo]

Watch for the nitrItes as well after you get an ammonia reading, then you may want to salt lightly. Helps them absorb oxygen which the nitrItes block.

[Cinnamon]

I did another water change yesterday and added Amquel for the ammonia. I did another test today and added some more Amquel. They seem to be doing fine. I am not feeding them normal. Just enough to get them by. Algae is setting up on the walls so they mow that all the time. Heck they started sucking on the walls before algae was ever there!:lol:

[philly]

Algea on the walls is good sign that means there good bacteria growing on the pond walls and your filter system before you know it you will be feeding as usual. :lol:

[Rembrandt]

We transplanted 5 of the bacteria tubes into the main filter out of the diy filter at the pond. It does appear they are trying to take. Just is a slow process. Patience. They have only been back on line for about a week. The fish are doing well and they are behaving normally and appear to have all of their spunk. Omega had a few traces of stress marks on him/her but they are just fine this morning. The only thing I worry about are those plants.:lol:
Those fish are convinced that there is something good to eat hidden in them and that all they have to do is search thoroughly enough.

[Jackie Ramo]

Fish love plants, to eat, to root through and to generally play with. For some reason mine are pulling the roots out ...

[philly]

Well mine definitely love the plants they have destroyed the arrowheads that Jackie gave me and are working on the water lilies now. :HAHA:

[Marg]

Why not give them a head of lettuce or a watermelon?
I have seen Koi eating these on line.
Mine like oranges. :yup:
Good luck,
Marg

[Cinnamon]

I use to give mine oranges and broccoli. That seemed to save my plants some. I started to buy broccoli Saturday but I wanted to wait until the pond cycled first.

[philly]

My koi for some reason does not like oranges anymore, will give broccoli a try and see what happens. :)

[Jackie Ramo]

They need to recognise it as food... or be very hungry best to skip a meal before introducing new foods or feed them together.

[philly]

Good advise starve them and they will have to eat what's given to them later on. :HAHA:

[Cinnamon]

Also if you can find kale at the grocery store. My love kale also :)

[Rembrandt]

Update Pics on the deck cover progress.
Wasn't expecting it to be that tedious when I started sketching it out. Progress is slow but moving forward.
Remmy

[philly]

It's looking good Remmy you have made a lot of progress, that is hell of a lot of coverage you have there but I imagine it would be great when the sun's very hot. :grin:

[Jackie Ramo]

I am sure the shade will be more than welcome when this is done. I bet it is hard work with the heat you folks are having this summer. Next year you can mount some ceiling fans and have a breeze as well as shade.

[Rembrandt]

Jackie, cieling fans are definately on the list of additions.
I still have to run additional wiring but that can wait for a while. Here is a picture I snapped last night from the deck.
She is getting there!

Remmy

[philly]

Pretty nice even if it's raining you could still have a peek at the koi. :yup:

[Jackie Ramo]

Looks great Rem, I can hear the blender making those umbrella drinks!!!:yup:

[Rembrandt]

Deck cover update:
Cinn sent me these pics today. She has started the painting. I finished the cover's gridwork this past weekend and thank goodness for I don't think I had anything left in me. Cinn snapped this picture of me.
Not a very flattering one but it speaks volumes. I don't even remember going to sleep that night I was so tired. Had been up since 4:30 am. The little lizzard by my shoulder is 'Geico'. He runs around the area and gets on my tennis shoe and sits. I have to watch so as not to step on him. Sony (our Siamese) likes to chase him through the patio door glass. Anyway, as you can see..... I was ready to call it a day. Will be nice though when we are finished.
Remmy

oh, the picture? It is 'Heiko and Geico':lol:

[carcha koi]

Looks great:yup:

[Marg]

Lots of work, but well worth it in the end.:yup:
Marg

[philly]

Remmy you're doing a great job, you will be done in no time at the speed you're going. :lol:

[Rembrandt]

Thanks for the pep-rally people! :grin:
I still remember sketching it out that evening and saying to myself that it wouldn't be anything to throw one of those together. Yeah right, famous last words at our place.
My 1st sketches were of a Western motife. The latter turned to more of a Colonial look. Wonder what it will look like covered in Christmas lights?
Remmy

[Rembrandt]

I asked the fish 'who bit the Lilly.......?' :lol:
They all denied it.

Remmy

[Marg]

I think my son brought back a sample Chili Pepper light from a string quite a few years ago. That would be a more southern feel for you...wouldn't it?

Chile peeper in the summer and Xmas in the winter....:lol:
Marg

[Jackie Ramo]

looks just great Rem you look tired after working so hard.

[philly]

OK Remmy no slouching till the job is done. :lol:

[Rembrandt]

:wink:
OK now, Remmy feeling just a wee bit guilty after leaving the house again this morning. Cinn had the plastic laid out across the deck and was back up on the ladders with her paint and paint brushes. The columns are now gleaming white and she is painting all of the upper structure white. Really looking good too. Got our first good cool snap so that will help it not being too hot.
Remmy

[Jackie Ramo]

Well if Cinn is painting then it must be almost all done!! \how wonderful

[philly]

Remmy you're one lucky guy Cinn helping you paint and I bet she's doing a pretty good job too, the MRS would have told me it's your project you do it and outside work is a man's job just like taking the garbage out and cutting the grass some people got it made but I'm pretty sure when you get back home you will work twice as hard. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

Deck cover project update with PICS:

Coming along slowly but surely! Hasn't Cinn done an awesome job? Also here is the new bridge rail rope we got last night thanks to some friends of my parents. They are co-owners of a place in Port Arthur, TX that refits tugboats, barges, etc on their tow lines. That was one very well appreciated donation. We are getting excited now. All that white is going to look TOUGH! :yup:
(Oh, the rope is 2 1/2 inches diameter)

Remmy

[philly]

Cinn has done a fantastic job from what's seen on the photos you took and your parents friends came through with the new rope for the railing, Remmy you're one lucky guy everything is falling into place nicely good luck on the rest and when you're all done you can come over and start on mine. :lol:

[Peg]

Looks Awsome, you two have done a great job. Bet you can't wait till its done so you can kick back and enjoy it.

[Rembrandt]

Thanks Peg, you definately got that one right. We are so close to being finished with the structure. Cinn has been working on the 2nd coat but now we are threatened with rain at least to Monday so for now, we are just on hold. She said the 2nd coat was really going fast but we can't compete with the rains. With this big tropical thing happening out in the Gulf now, we may be on hold for a while. They are predicting possible 10" rainfalls out of this mess. Beaumont, Tx (where I work) is holding its breath on the underpasses and uncompleted MAJOR drainage projects currently underway. As a claims adjuster, I guess I should look at it and consider it job security but 'dang it' [a little Southeast Tx jargon there], I just want to get the project finished. :(
Remmy

Thanks again for the compliments....

[Jackie Ramo]

Well the rains will make the plants grow so you can enjoy them while sitting on that great porch. Glad to see you've been keeping Cinn out of trouble and working hard!!!

[Cinnamon]

Yea I have been too busy to post. Well not enough energy after I get through painting in the heat! It rained all weekend so no painting. I thought I would get to paint this morning but it rained late last night so everything was wet. By the time it dried out it was too hot to get out there. One of these days I will get it finished! :lol:

Jackie when are you going to Spain? or have you already been?

[Jackie Ramo]

Cinn, you need to hit the new posts button when you come to the board. I've been to Spain and back again, loading pictures

I see on the news you are still getting rain

[philly]

With the rain falling Cinn will get a well needed rest before she starts painting again. :grin:

[Cinnamon]

Monday I didn't get to paint as it rained early in the am. Yesterday I had a dentist appt. But today I got back at it. It was a little cooler so I was able to work until about 11 am. I started at 7 am. I was so hot and tired after that I just laid on the couch!

Jackie I had a feeling you just got back when you didn't post for week or more :)

[marla]

Looks good Cinn, lay on the couch! that is a luxury, I'd have to kick Jerry off first.

[Rembrandt]

Hurray for us! Specially Cinn.
We got the deck sealed yesterday afternoon after an unknown length of time on this project. Cinn has really worked her butt off with the sanding and prep. Looks like a 42' long piece of furniture. Kinda hate to walk on it. She is suppose to be taking some pictures of it this morning. We'll get them up on the board as soon as we get them. We were very fortunate with the weather in that it was still warm enough to do outdoor painting and the rains stayed away from us. We still have the deck extension and the spiral steps to seal as well as he bridge but that will be a piece of cake. The biggest portion of the deck is done and we are ready to begin covering it.
Time to get to work here.
Remmy

[Rembrandt]

:5:
DECK PICS Update:
Cinn just sent these to me.
Remmy

[carcha koi]

Looks great. What seal did you use

[philly]

Fantastic job. Well done, :thumbsup:wished I had the space to put one in but then again there's not much room in the city houses backyard.:crybaby:

[Rembrandt]

Chris, it is called 'Flood'. It is an oil based stain. I told Cinn yesterday that the smell reminds me of the paints we used to use in the old 'paint-by-numbers' sets. We will have to be real careful when we do the bridge on the portion where it goes over the water. I can put some plastic under the bridge to catch any drips. It was right around $20 per gallon and it took 2 gallons to cover it. We have a little left over but not enough to finish the extensions. As with everything else, :doh: I'll have to make one more trip to the hardware store. It has a 2-4 year warranty depending on the use of indoor/outdoor. With the deck cover, we are hoping for the 4 year.
Remmy

[Rembrandt]

Thanks Philly!
It has been many years from the very start of that deck to get to the point where we are at now..... and I NEVER ever thought about adding a KOI point in with it. It just kinda happened but it all goes together well. Cinn has really put her back into the finish portion of this project. It would never have happened without her. We talked about that last night after cleaning up the tools. It should be safe to walk on it this evening. We have 3 acres at our place so room for projects has never been a problem for us. Now, finishing 'started projects' is another discussion for another thread. :HAHA:

[Jackie Ramo]

Simply beautiful. I see you both enjoying this very very much everyday. Good job, don't forget to finish it now!!!

[philly]

Remmy it still comes down to your other half agreeing with you and helping out the way Cinn did. I have to say she went that extra mile for you. :HAHA: Now you both can sit back and enjoy it but then again pond work is never done. :lol:

[marla]

Beautiful job, and such a nice large deck. Give her a good pat on the back and maybe a nice dinner out.

[Rembrandt]

The covering material was ordered after very careful measurements and security deposit paid. They should be delivering the material to us next Thursday. Now we are keeping our fingers crossed that the weather will cooperate and our volunteers don't get 'cold feet' and disappear on us. Cinn isn't quite happy with the finish on the deck and wants to re-do the surface. So then.........., we will be redoing the finish. As much work as she has put into this project, she said she won't be satisfied until she gets it perfect. Can't blame her. The stuff I bought the other day was 'almost' the same stuff we had used before on another project. Key word is 'almost'. :doh: Has the same company name on it but was not the same product. Stuff happens. :wink:
We did get the new white rope out on the bridge and it does look great. I'll have to get some pics of it.
ok, back to work here...
Remmy

[philly]

See Remmy! I TOLD you pond work is never done. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

:grin:
Grandkid pics
My son and family paid us a visit this past weekend and here are a few of the pics Nikki took of us at the Koi Pond.
Ryan was fascinated at the fish would just point and yell 'FISH!!' Weather was great.
And then there was the ceremonial filling of the feeders.
Remmy

[Rembrandt]

...just a few more pics

Remmy

[carcha koi]

Fish looke great, Kids enjoying the nice weather. Trade you for the weather:lol:

[Marg]

I'll bet you enjoy your pond more...the more the kids are delighted!
I enjoy my grandchildren's enthusiasm too.

Did your Koi get some interesting names?
Marg

[philly]

Water looks real clear and the kids are enjoying the koi too.:grin:

[Jackie Ramo]

Sweet shots Remmy thanks for sharing them, made me smile to see the kids so happy to see the fish, who are looking huge btw!!

[marla]

I'll bet you enjoy your pond more...the more the kids are delighted!
I enjoy my grandchildren's enthusiasm too.
Marg

Oh this is so true for me also

Rem the fish are HUGE and beautiful...nice and healthy looking
your grandkids are adorable, thanks for sharing

[philly]

Yes kids do look innocent till they start growing up. :HAHA:

[Rembrandt]

WELCOME BACK EVERYONE !welcome
Good to see the board back online.
Thanks for the compliments on the kids there. It was fun and little Ryan yells 'Pish!'. We really had to watch him as he wanted to get in there with them. He loves water.
Cinn called me earlier today and said that the 18-wheeler and forklift pulled up today and delivered the material for the deck cover. I have some friends lined up for this weekend and we will have an old fashioned 'barn-raising' festival at our place this weekend. We couldn't have ordered better weather for this event. Wish us luck.
Remmy

[Jackie Ramo]

Don't forget the pics Rem and to have fun!!

[Rembrandt]

Project update.....
3-steps forward, 4 steps back.
Saturday morning and our help is arriving. PERFECT weather. Couldn't have been better. Ladders placed in position, power cords laid out, all batteries charged, tools lined out, final position measurements taken.... and retaken for the predrilling of the panels, walked over to the material stack at the end of the driveway (which was carefully wrapped by the shippers for protection), started unwrapping the material,.... :banghead::mad:
Wrong stuff!!!!!! :blowup::badmood:!grrrr

Oh yeah, we were 'slightly' upset. And of course, they aren't open on weekends.
As a result, we have no pics.
Cinn made phone calls this morning and the material reordered.
Correct order should be here no later than two weeks.
Murphy's law is alive and well. Does Murphy's law apply in Canada?
Remmy & Cinn

[carcha koi]

We live by it. Speaking of that, on my way to work:censored:

[Jackie Ramo]

I think Murphy is Canadian and lives at my house. Tough break with the order

[marla]

I think Murphy is Canadian and lives at my house. Tough break with the order

well then his twin lives in mine:grin:
Wow, sorry for the mixup, hope you all sat back and had a drink to calm down and turned it into a party of fun instead of a party of work. Hope the next shipment is correct and maybe a discount due to there mistake would be extra nice.

[Rembrandt]

'k, here's the latest....
Material was reordered and they are going to expedite this order and it is possible we may have it for this weekend.
They are also going to waive all shipping charges. Since is was a custom cut, we are stuck with the metal they shipped. Great.... :banghead: Now I'll have to think of yet more projects to use that metal on.....

Anyhow, weatherman says we are suppose to get a repeat of last weekend's super weather. The 'Hurricane Ida' fortunately was a bust. The Gulf water temps are far to cool to support hurricane activity. It landed far, far east of us as a tropical storm with only 45 mph winds and leaving many frowns on the faces of the media weather people who were banking on a story. Oh well, we needed the break. The entire project is loaded with hurricane clips, retainers, anchors, etc. I'm sure we will someday get a chance to 'test' it. Just not this year. Built to Florida specs she is and then some.

Cinn is now working on refinishing the deck extension and the spiral steps and then that will leave only the bridge. :doh: We probably won't tackle that until Spring.
Seems it never ends.
Fish are happy though. :koi:

Water temps are mid 60's (F) so Cinn gave them their real food instead of the Honeynut Cheerios. They do go nuts over them though.
Time to get to work here.
Remmy

[philly]

Yes it was quite windy and a little choppy going to and back from Nassau but all in all the weather was hot thank goodness for that, now all I have to do is loose a few pounds around the waist. :lol:

[marla]

glad you got it reordered. could you sell the metal for scrap or how about a sculpture for the yard:wink: Hoping all goes well this weekend for you.

[Jackie Ramo]

Does this mean you pay twice for the metal???? Knowing you and Cinn Rem, you will find uses for it.

[Rembrandt]

Yeah Jackie, we will have to pay twice. The attaching hardware, flashing, etc. is okay so we are good there. Only have to order the sheetmetal because of the difference in the ridge. Simply stated, one style will work while the other won't. My brother-in-law and my parents are coming to the rescue on the sheetmetal as they are already scheming on projects at their places. I may hang onto a few sheets for a cover on the side of one of our outbuildings.....
The joys of being a home-owner.
I am now a wiser home-owner. :4eyes:
Remmy

[philly]

You could let them have it at a 50% discount so you could recover some of your cost unless they are always helping you out then you have to bite the bullet.

[Rembrandt]

Discount?? Me?? Well now that I think about it.... they sure are in the background in many of the pics we have taken in most of the phases of these projects.
Ok then. My mind is made up!
I will definately....... run it by Cinn. :lol:
Time to go home now.
Remmy

[philly]

I guess we know who's the boss now.:grin:

[Jackie Ramo]

There was never any doubt.

[Rembrandt]

ok ladies, I can do anything I want to. I am the man of this household and whatever I say goes.... as long as it is ok with Cinn. Right Cinn?? :doghouse:

Don't Forget.... tomorrow is Friday the 13th.
Remmy

[philly]

In that case I should stay away from work so I don't get hurt. :HAHA:

[Jackie Ramo]

Yeah, Rem, Smith is the boss around here .... I would never tell him different

[philly]

I would never tell him different

He wouldn't listen anyhow you know how us men are. :HAHA: