Viscosity and Water Changes

[Busy B]

Now Science never was my strong point so bear with me..

I'm doing water changes now between 5 and 7 days apart depending on what's going on around here. When it's close to the time of one, I can see the filter mats are gunking up pretty quick and now I'm rinsing them out more often mostly because the fish are eating more.

Pulling the water from the bottom for a water change, there is still some free floating debris/organics. But what I'm seeing after the change is there is more smaller particles floating than before. They seem to lighten up and "float". Am I just seeing things:-P or is it because the viscosity of the water has changed and is allowing the particles to be more free flowing and better able to be captured by the filters?

I'm pushing my stocking density now and anxiously awaiting the pond to melt and the fish to go back outside. Would more frequent water changes be beneficial?

[Jackie Ramo]

Yes, more water changes. I'm seeing the same now that I have Spice in with the rest. Did a 50% change today. I'm doing changes twice a week now. Even though the water tests fine I see a difference in the fish. Something the water tests aren't finding is being changed.

Part of the floaters are the water is distrubed from the bottom. Are you vacuuming?

[Busy B]

No...move my little sump pump around...such a small space for them now...they've grown so much thru the winter so they stir things up more when their going for the food..

I still think it has something to do with the 'texture' of the water.

[Jackie Ramo]

I do both but only vac once a week. I use the water in the vac to water the plants.

[Ian]

I find you get an algae or bacterial bloom(boom?) after a water change that can haze the water a little being on a well. Not like city water that has been treated as it seem to have a steralizing effect, the water had this clear crisp look to it after a change. There seems to be a lot of things that happen when you change the bacteria level of a pond via water change depending on it's source.
I do think that with the new water being introduced something sciency binds or combines molecules, particles of organic and non organic material with a whole lot of hard things to spell but the words look cool. In my simple way of looking at it is that certain things attract to each other and bind to be a bigger particles and others like algae bacteria that are in the source water find a food source bloom till the food source is gone.
There is enough science in water to leave viscosity to oil changes in your car :grin:

[ozzyrockman]

although I did spend 12 years as a Dealer mechanic I'm all too familiar with the term and its association with fluids however I've never considered looking at water.

Viscosity describes a fluids internal resistance to flow and water having low resistance I would think should not change very much. Now the partials in the water may be a different story.

I think Ian hit the nail on the head, ever time it rains heavy here in the dry state of Washington our ponds get hazed over and want to turn green then when the rain season slows and I am forced to do water changes from the city water source and the water stays clearer for much longer periods with much less run time for the uv to clear the string algae growth.

The day after our Gov declared a state of emergency for drought it started raining and I don't think we have had more than three clear days in the past month so our water in the big pond has probably been changed 100% twice in the past month but has started getting algae blooms however the covered qt has only received 4 10% water changes and is clear with only a hint of green and no algae bloom. Being covered the qt tank has no chance of getting water changes without intervention and the source of water is from a city well with all the good stuff in it including arsenic at only 10 ppb.

Yep still battling that one too however all water to our house now goes thru 3 Omni cansters and the drining water goes thru our new 110 gpd RO unit (thanks Graham for the suggestion). Allen

[Busy B]

So that's why your water always looks so clear in your pics Ian :grin:

So a water change is adding new minerals and bacteria too?

[Merlin]

ok a question :frisbee: I live around a 1000 yards from the nearest main road, the trafic in general in the UK is a lot less than that in the US, and most people drive a lot smaller vehicle ( seen the price of our fuel :-x ).

I do not undertake the amount of water changes that most of you do, yet my water remains in good condition. Do you feel that heavy polution by traffic warrents how often we do a water change. ??

[Ron C]

Not really Merlin. The main reason for water changes is to put back some of the minerals, and trace elements that the fish consume daily. If you use Koi Clay that isn't a worry. The other reason to do water changes are really two reasons, first to lower Nitrates in the water, second to lower dissolved organic carbons in the water. None of these things have to do with pollution, although it makes sense that the polution is in the air, and the air contacts the water, and/or is pumped into the water, so the pollutants would also. So water changes would lower the amount of the pollutants in the water.

Wow it looks like I got that out of a book or sumthin...... :frisbee:

[Merlin]

Not really Merlin. The main reason for water changes is to put back some of the minerals, and trace elements that the fish consume daily. If you use Koi Clay that isn't a worry. The other reason to do water changes are really two reasons, first to lower Nitrates in the water, second to lower dissolved organic carbons in the water. None of these things have to do with pollution, although it makes sense that the polution is in the air, and the air contacts the water, and/or is pumped into the water, so the pollutants would also. So water changes would lower the amount of the pollutants in the water.

Wow it looks like I got that out of a book or sumthin...... :frisbee:
Hey Ron as to the last bit I am sayin nothing :lol: But what you stated was interesting. it shows I still have a lot to learn :frisbee: I have looked at water changes as a way to remove polution , and never realised that fresh water is actualy puting something back that will help the fish. So am I correct in saying that although my water is fine, by upping the amount of water changes it will be even beter.

As I have said I do still have much to learn. :)

[Jackie Ramo]

You have to think of the fish in the wild and realize their water is being changed constantly via rivers and streams etc. Ours is a closed system so there are many many reasons for changing the water. Its like opening the windows and letting fresh air into the house. Everything Ron stated plus the fish give off hormones etc and these also need to be removed to ensure proper growth and development. This is another reason to know your source water. Some source water is pretty bad and needs treatment before it enters the pond. This is particularily true of deep well systems. City water needs to be monitored for the additives such as chlorine being increased at different times of the year and something month.

[Busy B]

Ron ..your a poet and didn't even know it! :lol:

Good advice tho..Can't say I live in as populated an area as lots of the rest of the country...pretty pure air here :wink:

Jackie...wouldn't a deeper well have cleaner water...less pollution to come in contact with from say a shallower well? *Is shallower a word...I can be shallow sometime* :frisbee:

Just ignore me...I'm brain dead...oh...and my feet hurt :lol:

[Ian]

I am a firm believer that water changes are the key to good health in koi keeping, fish keeping in general. With higher stocking rates it is a must for their survival ,as Jackie mentions it is a closed system in which we keep our koi and the water starts to degrade every day till it is a bad environment. With a good filter or even the best of filters is only slowing the process of your water going bad. Our koi are tough in that they can take lower oxyegen levels and more pollutants than most other species of fish. But we do not keep our koi to see there limits of survival but more to optimize there environment to ensure good health day after day. If one were to do a water change once a week or every two weeks and everything has been fine so far, try adding a change or two more a week for a while and you will see a difference in your koi. The colour ,the luster of it's skin, always hungry, and not to mention growth will increase.
Most important is the bachteria level of the pond increases (in a closed system) and gets to a point where it overwhelms the koi and ulcers start to appear, dropsy syptoms ect. Water changes keep the bacteria levels low and less bacteria that the fish's immune system has to fight off. Removing waste regularly from the pond is a big part of keeping the bacteria low as the waste is a good food source for parasites and bacteria.

A deep water well can have issues like low oxyegen levels and Co2 in it's place. Best thing in this case is to gass off the water from the well like spraying the water into the pond,or aerating it in a storage container before putting it into a pond. Some people make degassing towers in a pipe with some sort of media having the water smash and crash all the way down the pipe adding air and degassing the c02.

Pollution from cars and such is the big reason why not to pull rain water from the roof of a house to change water from a pond. If it does not rain for a while the pollutants will build up on the roof till it does rain and your pond will get a heavy dose of what may be collecting there.

[Jackie Ramo]

When I upped the water changes for the inside pond I saw a difference. I was doing 10-20% per week but its a small body of water and the fish were growing, started doing 2 water changes a week and the fish were hungrier and in better health judging by the shine on their scales. Now of course I am doing water changes of 20% everyday... as the fish in there are huge. I'm sure if I increased this they would be even happier but there is a limit to the hot water supply... that change drains the tank every morning.

Busy, while a deeper or bigger pond helps to keep the water more manageable but if you don't do water changes the wastes that we can't measure with our test kits still build up.

[Busy B]

Looks like I'm looking at doing more per week..*groan*

thanks for that info Ian...I knew I had read about it before but lost it in the recesses of my mind..

Our well is at 80 feet deep...could be why they sulk when I do a change..

[Jackie Ramo]

If they sulk when you do a change there is something not right. My guys play ing the chlorinated water coming in... I guess they don't know its bad for them...

[Busy B]

Low oxygen is what I'm guessing..

[Jackie Ramo]

Probably and maybe low pH. have you tested it?